Coaxial vs Optical

[stevo8040]

Much difference in the 2 sources. I have 2 Optical Inputs and I need 3 so I need to use 1 of the coaxial inputs. Much difference in sound? Any Rec's on a coaxial digital cable thats not to expensive? Thanks

[57U]

1. No difference in terms of sound quality.

2. An inexpensive "RCA" audio cable will do the job for audio. No need to spend more than $3.00, or use half of a "white/red" set that you've got lying around. Just make sure you have a good connection at each end.

[stevo8040]

So you don't recommend getting a true Digital Coaxial Cable. No difference at all from rca cable to this type. I was going to buy the Accoustic Research digital coaxial for $9.99 but if there is no difference between that and a RCA Cable, I'll just use 1 I have laying around!

[57U]

Hey, you can always experiment. Hook up analogue, digital (regular RCA), optical, expensive digital and switch back and forth. You may hear a difference between analogue (stereo only of course) and the 3 digitals, but I can guarantee you won't hear a difference between the three digital.

[Ratman]

I agree that there's no difference in the sound of coax or Toslink.
Although there are many advocates that coax is better for various reasons. I've have used both on my DVD player and couldn't detect a speck of difference.

As for the coax cable...
Yes, a plain old RCA phono cable will work, but just to point out that phono cables (red/white) are 50 Ohm and video (yellow) are 75 Ohm. Digital coax cables are 75 ohm also.

So my $.02 is... if you already have a "good" quality RCA A/V cables, use the yellow for the digital coax. I highly recommend that you put out the $10 and get the AR coax. Good construction quality and you don't have to question the audio quality.
Do it right the first time!

[57U]

Ratman, I agree - for $10, the piece of mind is probably worth it and you'll probably get a better connector.

It is the "connector" that makes most of the difference in all this cable talk. Bad connectors can corrode, come loose, etc.

That's why it's a good idea to remove, clean and reconnect all your audio video connections once a year. (You've got all your cables labelled at both ends don't you???) This will also give you a chance to clear any dust and cobwebs from the back of the equipment and any vents that keep the system cool.

BTW, I used my trusty ohmmeter to check the actual resistance of about 20 different cables I've got lying around the house (white, red, black, yellow, green blue, different thicknesses, different original prices, etc). They all came in at less than 0.5 ohms, meaning essentially no resistance to signal flow.

Some cables have better "shielding" that is supposed to prevent induced signals from other equipment/cables from harming the signal inside the wire, but that usually doesn't happen anyway...

So, if you've got a lot of money to throw around, spend it on cables, especially really expensive ones. If not, buy some "good quality" cables, hook them up and forget about them (for a year).

[nleaf]

Man, my head is swimming with the discussion of cables, wires and connections ... but I'll post to the newbie nook on that one....

The consensus from the experienced HT vets on this board is that monster cables for the video connections are overpriced and overrated ... nothing a good set of "Gold Ends" from Radio Shack can't do. But what about for the audio side of things? I imagine the speaker wire and cable to the sub that comes with most HTIB systems is pretty shoddy, so what should I replace it with? Is the monster cable for subwoofer connections as overpriced/overrated as it appears to be for video? What sub cable/speaker wire would any of you recommend considering I'm on a budget but willing to pay a little more for quality/improved performance? (I am aware of the importance of the connectors in the whole speaker/audio equation ... just not about the wire/cable itself). Your pearls of wisdom please? Thanks in advance.

[57U]

Sometimes speaker wires come with the HTB. These can be fairly short runs and sometimes the HTB connections are even "proprietary" (special for that particular setup). If that's the case and they are long enough, use those wires.

If they are not proprietary, you can use electrical (lamp) cord for the speaker wire. If you've got a short run (<10'), use 14 gauge. If its longer use 12. If it's really long, use 10 or 8. That's all you need for the speakers. You can buy this stuff by the foot at various stores. Some electronics stores will even give it to you when you buy the "Stereo" from them.

Now, the sub usually has an "RCA-type" jack. For the sub use a quality like the Radio Shack "gold ends" unless you have a long run (more than 15-20' say). Then you can consider something like AR, etc.

To me, it would just be silly to spend $500 for a HTB and spend much more than $50 to connect everything. (Even the Ultralink guy would agree with that - his "rule of thumb" was 10-15% for cables and he's trying to sell cables.)

Up until 10 years ago, everyone was happy with 18 ga speaker wire and plain old RCA connectors. By going one or perhaps two steps up from that, you will ensure a good sounding and looking system.

[mbtlriley]

I just have to chime in on this subject because I thought there was no difference in the sound of a toslink and a coax cable also, but there is. I own an Integra Research Preamp Processor, DVD-Audio Player and Aragon Ampliers. I didn't think anything beyond Monster cable was necessary and for the most part it isn't. But after talking to Steve at "Quest For Sound" (Audiogon.com), I decided to try high end Pheonix Gold cables and compare them with my Monster speaker cables & interconnects. Wow! what a noticable difference. For digital I bought a highend Pheonix Gold toslink cable and used it for my primary DVD digital connection. I wasn't overly impressed with the sound especially for music listening. The sound was dry, clinical, harsh, somewhat bright, and all over the place. I preferred the analog sound which was smooth, sweet, wide, accurate, and pleasurable. I just thought it was the DA's. I assumed a DVD player just couldn't compete in sound quality (even a $3000 player) with a good stand alone CD player. I was dead wrong. Steve asked me to try a Pheonix Gold coax and I did. Immediately the sound was warm, smooth, open and airy. It had an improved soundsage; the midrange was liquid and accurate; almost rivaling the direct analog feed. There was very little difference. I now enjoy listening to any digital source; music or movie, because the eratic, dry, clinical sound is no more. I tried other toslink cables and they all performed similarly. Coax is hands down, better sounding. Steve made me a believer. (I don't work for Quest for Sound, I just enjoy good sound & video.)

My system includes: Integra Research RDC-7 Pre-Pro; Intergra Research RDV-1 DVD-Audio player; Aragon 8008X5, and 8008BB power amps; Tice 3B-HP powerblock; Outlaw ICBM Bass Management unit; Pioneer elite laserdisc & cassett players; RCA S-VHS player; Otari reel to reels; Atlantic Technology 350THX speakers (7); Velodyne 18" sub; NHT 10" sub; Mitsubishi Diamond WS-55909 HDTV; Pheonix Gold, AudioQuest, Outlaw & Monster Z series cables & interconnects.

[hpmoon]

Forgive me for sounding too forward, but let's get real about this. There's a phenomenon called psychoacoustics that involves the nonsense of people hearing the exact same thing twice and calling each distinctive.

There is no conceivable difference in sound quality between optical and coaxial digital feeds. In other words, it is impossible according to science.

What you may perceive are extremely obvious dropouts in that the digital stream could get completely interrupted by a severe fold in the fiber optic cable of an optical connection. That's it.

Please, please do not purport your psychoacoustical assumptions as truth. We have all moods, but moods are not science.

[Jester]

Thank you 57U and hpmoon for providing remarkable clarity on the subject of digital connections. I cannot even count the number of times that I have had to listen to the psycho babblings of the audio "converted."

GIVE ME A BREAK!

The companies like AR and Monster Cable that are selling heavily over-engineered cables do it because people will buy them and it makes them rich.

I typically do not chime in on discussions such as this one, because people who have been brainwashed into thinking they can HEAR the difference are by nature logic impaired.

You can imagine my surprise to find the moderator bravely suggesting lamp cord to connect speakers! Thank you 57U, forever let logic prevail!!!

[Wolfpacker96]

I'm sorry, but I think you are dead wrong about your comments to mbtlriley. If you are in the audiophile/videophile range of gear ($10,000 systems) interconnects and cables can make a HUGE difference. And if you're spending that much on your gear why would you put in cheap interconnects? Now if you are only watching DVDs through your Best buy theater in a box system, you would likely not notice a difference in wiring, but if you plug in a Diana Krall cd into your $10,000 system with cheap wiring I will guarantee that you would notice. I used to be a nonbeliever too but I have a friend that works at a audiophile/videophile store and was able to spend time comparing different cabling and interconnect products. It's the same reason why an Emachine doesn't perform as well as a similarly equipped Alienware.

Just my 2 cents!

[57U]

WP, we agree, we just think there comes a point of diminishing returns. We all know that a $100,000 system is not 10X as good as a $10,000 system. Same way with interconnects, once you reach the level of a "good" cable (probably about $25-$50 depending on the connector), then spending more gets you very little, if anything.

Just be aware that for digital signals a $1.99 cable can transmit them just as well as a $1000 cable, as long as the connection is good. The signal either makes it or it doesn't. Look at the conductor thickness in a DVI/Firewire cable...

As stated here many times, buy what your comfortable with, if it works to your satisfaction, don't look back.

[mbtlriley]

Maybe you folks have tested cables and have discerned no difference, but that has not been my experience. I owned a Toshiba SD-5109 DVD player and connected it with a Radio Shack coax cable. The sound was sort of muffled. I got use to and thought I just needed better electronics. I had a top of the line Pioneer Elite VSX-99 receiver at the time. The next year I upgraded to a $4000 Aragon amplifier and a $4000 Integra Research Preamp processor. I replaced the Toshiba with a $3000 Integra Research RDV-1 DVD/Audio progressive scan player. Purchased balanced audio interconnects and better speaker cables. But I didn't replace the digital cable right away. The new equipment produced a similar muffled sound from the DVD player. I was frustrated.

I talked to Steve Monte of Quest For Sound.com, and bought a high quality Phoenix Gold toslink cable. The difference in sound was astonishing. The muffled sound was gone. It was crisp, clean and open. Though I liked the sound with movies, it seemed harsh when playing CDs. I thought it was my speakers or even the DVD player (my laserdisc player sounded better). I have Atlantic Technology 350THX speakers and just assumed they were not suited for music. I called Quest For Sound again and talked to Steve Monte about new speakers or a dedicated CD player, and he suggested I try an similar quality coax cable because he had discovered coax sounded better. I bought the coax and compared the sound to the toslink. I couldn't believe how different the sound was. It was smoother, and more natural sounding. It wasn't as clinical or digital sounding. Especially, with the high frequency instruments like cymbols. I had several friends over and asked if they could hear any difference and they all said the same thing. The coax cable sounded better.
So, you "Nay Sayers" can dismiss my claims and opinion all you want, but it won't change what my ears and others have discerned.

P.S.-I only mentioned the cost of the gear to illustrate that poor cables can make anything sound like crap.

[57U]

mb, whatever differences you heard were due to the electronics in either the player or the preamp, not the cables. The cables can only transmit whatever digital signals they get.

I'm sure other people can provide similar examples of differences, but it ain't the cables, it simply can't be.

I find it odd that you'd hear a significant difference between Toslink and digital coax in such high end equipment, however, your equipment is to "blame" for the difference in the sound.

[Wolfpacker96]

Sounds like you have a very nice setup
mbtlriley. And I personally agree with you that good quality interconnects and cables can make a difference. But it's all a factor of what you're happy with. If someone thinks that an inexpensive cable sounds as good as an expensive one (or maybe I should say a better quality one) that's great!! I wish I didn't notice a difference and could spend the money elsewhere! But unfortunately for me, my friend who is in the audiophile business let me listen to systems in the store where he worked that cost twice as much as the freaking car I drive!!!! Luckily for me said friend also let me buy a very good quality used Lexicon preamp, all my wiring and interconnects, and all of my speakers (M&K) for cost. And he sold me some of his used equipment at a very good price. Stuff doesn't cost anywhere near the price of my car, but it sounds good enough for me (as long as I don't go back to his store again!!).

For a system of your quality, you have to use good connections or you've wasted your money that you spent on the equipment.

[Wolfpacker96]

I see your point on the theoretical aspect of the digital cable. Since the signal is digital, either it works or it doesn't. But I swear I can hear a difference with them in a side by side comparison. But I am talking about comparing very good quality stereo jazz or classical. Not home theater. I doubt very much I could tell a difference listening to a movie or even a concert video in 5.1. The difference I've noticed is in the sound stage of stereo sound. And very subtle difference at that. With 5.1 sound, since the sound stage is created differently, you likely couldn't tell the difference. I have no idea how they do it, and maybe I'm crazy :eek: , but swear I can hear a difference.

[Ratman]

IMO...
You hear what you WANT to hear. After you spent your kid's milk money, you make yourself hear a difference to justify the tactic or $$.

I challenge anyone to a double blind test using coax/optical (moderate quality) and coax/optical (expensive quality). Also... this needs to be performed at a 'neutral' location/listening room (I.E. not 'your/my' hardware, not 'your/my' living room)

Can we arrange to do this in Cancun?:D

[mbtlriley]

I agree with you Wolfman. I got your back. All I know is that as a jazz musician I prize my auditory abilities. I've learned to trust my senses and I know what most musical instruments sound like. I can tell if someone is slightly out of tune (sharp or flat) or if a guy is playing with a new reed or even a plastic reed. I can tell if someone is using a metal mouthpiece or plastic. I know if a musician is playing with metal strings or nylon. Sometimes I can tell the make of a particular instrument. Whether live or electronic I can hear this kind of detail. Of course, if electronic, all this depends on how transparent and accurate the playback system is, and cables do contribute to that transparency; even digital cables. Just as Wolfman said, it may be less of an issue when it comes to Home Theater, but with fine stereo listening the differences in the digital sonic presentation is quite noticable. To what degree? That's arguable. But there is definitely a perceptible difference. I guess sometimes you just have to agree to disagree.

[billw]

I have Monster Cables and I am willing to volunteer for a test!

Ah ta heck with it, I like the idea of Cancun.

Maybe I can pound some Corona's and Frozen Margaritas so I can forget I spent $39 on a coxial cable!!!!!!!!!!

[kook]

DO the comparison blind folded, and have someone else hook the cables up. Repeat a handful of times. See if you got it "right" each time. ;)

[mbtlriley]

Already did blindfold tests with four friends. Blind folds made no difference in the listening results. The variations in sonic character was not that subtle. A novice could hear the difference. In my tests the coax cable sounded better than the equal quality toslink.

[laveller]

OK, heres my 2 cents, while I may be new to hdtv I am not new to high end audio and digital audio...been playing with audio since high school in the 70's and bought my first cd player for $1000 in 84 and have spent a small fortune on the stuff in the last
30 years...proably spent 10K just on magazines!

the plain fact of the matter is that toslink and coax digital carry the same signal but in very different ways. The quality of the information, the 0' and 1' is EXACTLY the same. Coax modulates and electical impluse, toslink is fiber optic, as in light. Now assuming that the SAME signal gets to a toslink connection and a coax connection, the signal the other end will be the same as well... identical, no difference, nada, nothing, zip...you get the point. the problem is in the first clause of the last sentence..."assuming that the SAME signal gets"... A whole lot of stuff happens to a digital signal from when it gets picked up as a series of bumps on a CD or DVD, to when it gets dumped into your digital cable...likewise at the other end of the cable a whole lot of stuff happens between when the cable ends and when your speakers start to dance. Are the electonics in the coax path the same as the electonics in the toslink path ... NO, NO, and NO. and in some cases the sound of a component may be different based upon the different transducers etc in the signal path. but its a function of the component's internals...not the freakin cable. There is no high quality "0"...no smooth rounding on a "1"...its either a "0" or a "1" and that's it. Interesting fact: the coax path has LESS electonics in it than the toslink. So there is no universal answer.

On the topic of spending $100 on speaker wire versus $1000 per foot...get real...TO THE BEST OF MY KNOWLEDGE THERE HAS NEVER BEEN A PUBLISHED DOUBLE BLIND TEST OF SPEAKER WIRE THAT HAS IDENTIFIIED A MATHMATICALLY STATISICALLY SIGNIFICANT DIFFERENCE IN PERCIEVED SOUND. Buy some nice good quality RS 12 guage speaker wire, solder on good connectors and enjoy

oh and another thing...some night when your alone, at
about 2 in the morning...turn off all the lights and watch
"Signs".

-------------------------------------------------------------

DVD... Pioneer Elite 45a (for SACD's and DVDA's)
DVD... Panasonic RP82 (for video)
Receiver... Yamaha 1300
STB... Sansung TS160
Remote... Sony 3000
Projector... Sony HS10
Screen...Da-Lite
Speakers... Klipsch RS series all the way around
LD player Pioneer 500
Beer and Scotch...yes, thanks, I'd love some.

[Wolfpacker96]

Originally posted by laveller
On the topic of spending $100 on speaker wire versus $1000 per foot...get real...TO THE BEST OF MY KNOWLEDGE THERE HAS NEVER BEEN A PUBLISHED DOUBLE BLIND TEST OF SPEAKER WIRE THAT HAS IDENTIFIIED A MATHMATICALLY STATISICALLY SIGNIFICANT DIFFERENCE IN PERCIEVED SOUND. Buy some nice good quality RS 12 guage speaker wire, solder on good connectors and enjoy

I understand there is probably no difference in high quality digital cable, but I don't follow your statement on speaker wire. We're not talking about statistics. We're talking about perference. I'm sure most of the populace couldn't tell the difference, but if you're a big music fan you can hear subtle differences in different types of speaker wire. That's why there is an audiophile/videophile industry (either that or we're all just a bunch of idiots throwing away our money :) ). Now I don't have thousands of dollars to run around testing wire, but I have played around with this in my friend's audiophile store. I hear subtle differences, but it's all a matter of perference.

But of course, all of us can argue about it until we're blue in the face (or in the fingers in this case!) and never come to an agreement. When should I book that flight to Cancun?

[Ratman]

I just bought a "Monster" parallel printer cable and I swear that that my printer now prints faster and the colors are more vibrant!!!
NOT......:D

[mbtlriley]

On the Optical vs. coax issue I've read several articles suggesting coax cables sound better. Here's the link and the article. I'll try to find others.

http://www.audiovideo101.com/learn/askus/displayaskus.asp?questionid=101&List=7[/URL]

Coaxial versus TOSLINK digital audio cables - which is better?

Question:
I keep seeing references to the superiority or coaxial digital interconnects versus optical ones, but no one says either why or what the audible difference is. So my question is, why are they better, and what is the audible difference? After all, they are just sending a bunch of zeros and ones from one place to another, what makes one better?

Response:
Each cable does indeed carry the same signal, a simple stream of ones and zeroes - seems like that should be easy. In theory the different types of digital cables (coaxial, TOSLINK optical, and others) should not have any audible differences. However, in theory rarely translates to in fact, which is the case with these cable types.

The task of sending ones and zeroes through the wire is fairly simple. A coaxial cable sends an electric signal with its voltage or lack there of representing the digital bits. An optical cable (TOSLINK as used by most people) sends pulses of light to represent the same bits. The optical TOSLINK cable uses thin, clear plastic fibers to transmit the pulses of light. The problem with this design is that the light tends to bounce around inside the cable, especially when the cable is turned in fairly tight curves or extends long distances. As the light bounces around, it throws off the timing of the signal. A digital signal''s series of ones and zeroes should arrive in a very exact time frame. When the bits do not arrive at quite the right time we encounter jitter. Jitter is simply a timing error, but this timing error can create audible distortion. So transmitting the bits is not the only job of a cable, minimizing (or not introducing) jitter is another important task.

Coaxial cables are subject to jitter problems, it is not an issue for TOSLINK cables only, however, coax cables tend to suffer from less jitter problems. Thus is the signal is the same but the coaxial cable introduces less distortion in the form of jitter timing errors the coax connection can produce a more perfect signal. Is there a difference? Yes. Is it audible? It can be. Should you be concerned? Not overly. If you have the option between coaxial and TOSLINK digital connections, go the coaxial route. If you have no option, the differences are subtle and TOSLINK works fine as a transmission format for digital bits. Coaxial versus TOSLINK digital audio cables - which is better?

Question:
I keep seeing references to the superiority or coaxial digital interconnects versus optical ones, but no one says either why or what the audible difference is. So my question is, why are they better, and what is the audible difference? After all, they are just sending a bunch of zeros and ones from one place to another, what makes one better?

Response:
Each cable does indeed carry the same signal, a simple stream of ones and zeroes - seems like that should be easy. In theory the different types of digital cables (coaxial, TOSLINK optical, and others) should not have any audible differences. However, in theory rarely translates to in fact, which is the case with these cable types.

The task of sending ones and zeroes through the wire is fairly simple. A coaxial cable sends an electric signal with its voltage or lack there of representing the digital bits. An optical cable (TOSLINK as used by most people) sends pulses of light to represent the same bits. The optical TOSLINK cable uses thin, clear plastic fibers to transmit the pulses of light. The problem with this design is that the light tends to bounce around inside the cable, especially when the cable is turned in fairly tight curves or extends long distances. As the light bounces around, it throws off the timing of the signal. A digital signal''s series of ones and zeroes should arrive in a very exact time frame. When the bits do not arrive at quite the right time we encounter jitter. Jitter is simply a timing error, but this timing error can create audible distortion. So transmitting the bits is not the only job of a cable, minimizing (or not introducing) jitter is another important task.

Coaxial cables are subject to jitter problems, it is not an issue for TOSLINK cables only, however, coax cables tend to suffer from less jitter problems. Thus is the signal is the same but the coaxial cable introduces less distortion in the form of jitter timing errors the coax connection can produce a more perfect signal. Is there a difference? Yes. Is it audible? It can be. Should you be concerned? Not overly. If you have the option between coaxial and TOSLINK digital connections, go the coaxial route. If you have no option, the differences are subtle and TOSLINK works fine as a transmission format for digital bits.

[laveller]

try this one ... and then we'll get into the quantum mechanics versus relativity discussion...

http://www.jitter.de/english/engc_navfr.html

...actually the above, while a little bit marketing in nature,
is a very interesting discussion on digital jitter... or
relational time errors as the IT pukes call it.

[57U]

I was hesitant to open this thread again, but anyway, here goes. See the link for the "definitive answer"

http://members.cox.net/pjaceto/

Answer is - "...Cable choice cannot affect sound quality"

[laveller]

outstanding article...thank you Mr. "U"

[Wolfpacker96]

Just to totally change my previous point on speaker wire, check out this link:

http://home.earthlink.net/~rogerr7/wire.htm

I have no idea who this guy is, but he totally agrees with 57U in that all this audiophile speaker wire isn't any better, just costs more. And there doesn't seem to be very many legitimate speaker wire comparisons out there.

[57U]

This gentleman appears to be affiliated with McIntosh. If anyone has ever had the pleasure of owning, using or listening to McIntosh equipment, you'd "understand".

McIntosh and Bryston - buy the quality, ignore the specs, because most times the specs are meaningless.

[Ratman]

I just ran a new 18 AWG (used to be 22 AWG) wire from my front door to the doorbell and I swear... the bell rings with more clarity and the soundstage is focused! (Of course, this was after a two week 'break in' period!)

Sorry...:D

[kevinw]

(used to be 22 AWG) wire from my front door to the doorbell and I swear... the bell rings
with more clarity and the soundstage is focused!

Can your dog tell the difference? He could if he lived in Germany.
Thats twice today Ratman has brought a level of sarcasm that only few can hope to achieve...You da man:D

[57U]

Originally posted by Ratman I just ran a new 18 AWG (used to be 22 AWG) wire from my front door to the doorbell and I swear... the bell rings with more clarity and the soundstage is focused! This is a blatant lie.

The wire from the front door simply activates a switch on the doorbell (sort of like a digital signal).

In order to achieve sonic perfection you'd have to improve, replace or reposition the doorbell.

I don't think improving, replacing or repositioning the power transformer would have a significant effect.

Now, if you replaced that wire from the front door to the doorbell with an optical cable....

he, he.

[HiD-ho]

After Ratman’s encouragement I upgraded the wiring in my house. The results were astounding!:eek: When I turn on my lights there is no longer that sluggish response time that most of us have been complaining about for years. The quality of light is unparalleled; I think I boosted the candlepower by 10%. And yes it did stand up to the blindfold test; I even had someone else turn on the lights! As and added bonus I can now make soft boiled eggs in only 90 seconds! Now 57U I know you’re going to be a wet blanket so I confess I lie, I really can’t make soft boiled eggs any quicker so the laws of physics remain intact. But seriously, beauty or sound quality is in the ear of the beholder. Perception is reality, if the man says it sounds better to him than it does. Now can't we all get along?

[Skyboss]

Opticals are fine on short runs, but if you have along run on a digital signal, Coaxial is easier to work with and less suseptable to damage. If you can afford them, find units with AES connections.

[billw]

what are AES connections - how do they benefit?

[akthor]

Well I have both, I have a digi coax from my DVD to my AVR and its a 20' RS gold RCA, sounds fabulous. I also have a 50' run of coax cable (TV cable) one end plugs into the soundcard on my computer and the other into a digital coax to optical converter and then a 12' RS optical cable into my AVR and I play my MP3's and also sounds fabulous.

[FatDog]

Has anybody realized that a coaxial-digital cable also connects the signal ground between two devices together?

Look at your DVD power cord - no grounding pin.

The shield in a coaxial cable connects the zero-volt ground on the DVD player to the zero-volt ground in the receiver. An optical cable does not.

While this grounding issue should not affect the ones and zero's that transfer, it DOES affect the low-power analog circuitry in the receiver.

This might explain why people have heard a difference when they go between the two types.

[twonami]

I've finally had a experience where Optical out was better than Coaxial and this was concerning my Samsung STB and Sony receiver. I am using a long run of 35ft ( cheaper to run long audio cables than video cables ) and I was having intermittent audio drops while attached via coax. I hooked it up with a shorter cable, 6ft and the problem went away but since I need length I bought a 35ft Optical cable from A2zcables.com and the problem is no longer there. I Just thought it might help someone make a decision.

[akthor]

My problem was with a 50' run of digi coax I had a severe ground loop problem after many attempts to fix the problem I ended up with a digi coax to optical converter and an optical cable at the receiver end and it worked like a charm.

[twonami]

50ft! Wow I thought I had a long run. How long is the coax and fiber optic? Which converter are you using?

[akthor]

I am using a 50' run of Radio Shack double sheilded gold TV coax cable with adapter plugs on each end, one end plugs into the digital out on my soundcard in my PC and the other into a Radio Shack digital coax to optical converter then an 8' Radio Shack optical cord from the converter to an optical in on my AVR. Works great. I still use digi coax from my DVD to AVR but it is only a 20' run or so and I have no ground loop probs, prolly you don't have any ground loop probs with a digital signal anyways. But my AVR only had one digi coax in so I had to utilize one the many optical ins for my PC connection.

The reason I had to do this is because I use my PC and it's library of MP3's as my source for music listening and when I got my HDTV I no longer had room in the living room for the PC and it's corresponding furniture and the PC had to be moved to my bedroom at the other end of the house and instead of the run from PC to stereo being 12' or so it became 40+ feet. I had a real bad ground loop hum with 40+ feet of RCA cables and in my search for a solution someone pointed out to me that if my soundcard had a digital output that the digital solution would solve my problem. It took a while to get it all figured out but in the end I couldn't be happier. On a side note with my PC being in the bedroom it made it inconvenient to keep tromping to the bedroom to change songs and such so I also got an ATI all in wonder RF remote to run my PC so that I can change songs and adjust volume from anywhere in the house or yard.

http://mirror.ati.com/products/remotewonder/features.html

[nuke61]

If you can hear a difference between coax and optical DIGITAL signals, you're either fooling yourself OR there's a problem with the implementation in the receiver/player/viewer of the optical and coax circuits.

If you can hear a difference between thick power cord (i.e., 12 gauge or larger) and "audiophile" speaker cable, you're also fooling yourself.

http://web.archive.org/web/20010716115548/www.oakland.edu/~djcarlst/abx_wire.htm

[mbtlriley]

Yeah Right! How about this one. If you can not hear the difference between some coax and some optical cables, your hearing may not be as sharp as those who can. Don't get mad...just a theory.:)

[mbtlriley]

Yeah Right! How about this one. If you can not hear the difference between some coax and some optical cables, your hearing may not be as sharp as those who can. Don't get mad...just a theory.:)

[LeeS]

There's an echo, must be your optical cable :).

(that was a joke, no need to get so serious)
Lee