Please help me with the ws-65711 picture!!!

[slc1t]

I recently exchanged a 65905 for a 65711. 65905 had a blinking problem. The 65905 had a great picture. Especially with DVDs. DVDs were so crystal I thought I was right there in the action. I couldn't format the 480p signal -- which i didn't care about anyway.

Got the 65711 and almost barfed when I saw the picture. Everything looks worse. My 65905 was never calibrated - I used avia disk once and saw minor improvements. Cable signal looks very grainy on the new model. Amazingly, DVD 480p is the worst signal on the 65711. Very grainy, ghosting, pixelization like crazy. You can format the 480p image which makes me wonder if mits is messing with the native 480p signal coming from the dvd player. I can't see how a professional calibration will fix the problems I am seeing. I am of the opinion that mits has gone downhill with their image quality. I work in imaging so I see all artifacts. Mits has taken a huge dive in my opinion. I feel bad for them. The best picture I get from the tv is with a single video component input. Yikes. I will be most likely returning this and asking for a hitachi or something different.

Another problem with my set happens when views are switched. For example, tonight I was watching Seinfeld. Alot of view switches. For only an instant before the new view is displayed, there is the new picture with very bad horizontal lines. Took me 2 days to figure out what was bugging my eyes. Now I see it all the time.

Anyone else seen image problems with the new 2002-2003 models? Is there a special service code someone needs to enter in order to enable true 480p??? Shouldn't products be easy to use and shouldn't they get better with time. Sure mits has more features, net command, firewire inputs, but bottom line is they are selling an image and the image is worses than the old 65905. Please help before I switch to a new brand.

Chet in Boise.

[drb]

If the vendor will allow you to rid yourself of that Mitsubishi, suggest you do so. See thread 'blinking timer light', I'm stuck with a 400 pound stinking pile, and Mitsubishi could not care less.

[wmayo]

I have the 55" version of your set, and I have had not problems. 480p works flawlessly, and DVDs look great. My 2003 model is MUCH brighter than any previous model, and that is with the brightness and contrast turned WAY down low. It's vivid and colorful. Sorry to hear of your problems. My only thing, is that the right 5" or so is just very slightly out of focus. Hardly even noticeable -- will have to get high tech in to make better.

Good luck.

WM

[slc1t]

wmayo,

Thanks a lot for taking time to reply to my post. As part of my research for this problem I went around to different stores and looked at the performance of various models. One store had a 2003 55" diamond model on display. They were feeding it 480p from a dvd player. The picture looked flawless just as you described. Colors were bright - as they are with mine, and there was no graininess in the picture. Very smooth, very detailed, no artifacts - similar to my old 2000 model.

So that has me wondering if there is a problem with the manufacturing process between the 55 inch and the 65 inch model. Granted, a bigger picture size will make artifacts more noticeable, but I had my face 1 foot from the 55 inch screen and it looked good. No ghosting etc...

The store also said that they had not calibrated it yet and that it was basically at the factory default setting. Just curious, did you have your model calibrated by a technician i.e. isf calibration? Or was the picture good right out of the box?

Thanks again for your reply.

Chet

[wmayo]

To answer your question - It came out pretty much fine right out of the box - which I understand is fairly normal for Mits sets. I will eventually get an ISF calibration to deal with a VERY slight out of focus on the right few inches. Other than that, the screen is extremely well focused, converged, and great balanced color.

I can't tell you how many sets I've seen at Best Buy and Circuit City in which the sets were horribly out of focus, terrible contrast, etc. The latter is easier to fix, but on some of the sets, there was NOTHING I could do in the store to improve the focus since that is a higher tech thing, and not generally user accessible (at least through the standard menus).

I saw the larger size in the store w/HD signal and it looked great. However, I would be concerned about regular broadcast on THAT size of screen. It would almost have to look bad. My 55" barely keeps from looking quite rough because of sheer size of "blown up" image from a low quality image to begin with. The exception for all of these is if you are quite a distance from the set. That almost always cures the blow up problem.

Finally, there should be NO ghosting - assuming it isn't in the signal itself (esp. from an antenna). No ghosting also applies to DVD. Something is really wrong if that happens.

W Mayo

[sirvodka]

Newbie here. I really enjoy this forum. Excellent information. I'm hoping more people will post their experiences with the WS-65711. Right now I'm looking at purchasing either the Mits WS-65711 or the Hitachi 65XWX20b. Not sure which one yet but I have a couple months to decide.

Steve

[57U]

Steve, welcome to the forum. These are both great sets. My only suggestion would be to look "one model down" without the built in digital tuner. Saves $ and gives you flexibility with the STB. STBs are changing rapidly, with features added all the time (PVR, etc).

If you havn't browsed the FAQ section, 6th one down on the home page, it's also a good place for those new to HDTV to start.

Happy Hunting

[sirvodka]

57U,

Thanks for the reply. I've read some of your posts and you supply some great information and advice. The integrated tuner option is something I was debating because of cost. With all of the different manufacturers with multiple models it's easy to over research and get completely confused. Last weekend I went to Audio King just to look at the different models from Mitsubishi. It seemed to me that the higher end sets (Diamond) had much better PQ than the lower end sets (Platnum, Gold). Was this just my imagination or are they setup that way on purpose so people buy the more expensive sets? I have read a lot of opinions from all forums that you just have to go to the store and compare picture quality for yourself. Most of the video technical specs of the various models go right over my head anyway. Also, my purchase may depend on if I decide the TV should have DVI. I know there is a lot of debate on that subject but I do have Directv and may just purchase the Hitachi for (peace of mind).

Steve

P.S. The Circuit City salesperson told me that the Hitachi's have the best PQ out there. Even better than Mits (Diamond) and Pioneer Elite. I told this to the Audio King salesperson. He smiled and said he would bring that up in the next sales meeting and they would all get a big laugh out of it.

[57U]

A couple of quick points.

1. Mits are probably the sets that require the least tweaking when you get them home - their factory settings are not as close to "torch mode" as some other sets.

2. The Hitachis have excellent upconversion.

3. Since most sets are not properly calibrated in stores, comparing picture quality at a store is next to useless.

4. The only true comparison would be at a "smaller retailer" that has calibrated both sets and you could see them side-by-side. Even then, they may tweak one set better than another, depending on their preference...;)

[sirvodka]

57U,

Thanks again for the input. It makes sense what you said about comparing sets at the store. But I had heard differently in a couple other forums. I'm getting to the point where I think this may be the best solution. Pick out a set I think is best for what I want, buy it from a retailer that has a good return policy, try it out and if I don't like it exchange it for another. Sorry if this thread got away from the origional subject.

Steve

[wmayo]

I reread my earlier post, and realized it may imply something I didn't mean. I believe ghosting can only come from a bad circuitry problem in the set or tuner (barring mirror/lens flaws). Ghosting CANNOT come from the antenna signal itself. Digital signals either lock or they don't. Multipath can fight against a good lock, but it is NOT possible for multipath to cause ghosting on a digital signal/set.

WM

[kevinw]

Between the magazines and the forums and the days of researching before I purchased, I gleaned this info

Mitsubishi-most expensive but best picture out of box on the topline models good on lower level. Ok stretch modes.

Hitachi more reasonably priced still need some out of box work and poor stretch modes but is a top performer better than the low level Mits.

Toshiba poor out of box, best stretch modes and after calibration is equal to the more exspensive Hitachi and Mitsubishi midlevel products.
These were the only 3 brands that I had considered purchasing.

[slc1t]

Hi all,

Thanks for all of the great information. I'd like to add just a couple of things here. PQ is in my opinion one of the most important things about an hdtv. So before you make your decision, figure out what you will be watching most. For example, I watch a little bit of tv but not much. The picture is pretty crappy with my cable connection but really I don't care that much. Seinfeld, the news, some basketball -- I can deal with bad reception. However, when I watch a movie I want to feel like I am in another world. I don't want to be reminded by crappy pq that I am sitting in front of a crappy tv. So if movies are important, have them hook up a progressive scan dvd player and play it for you. Trust me, you will be glad you did, because even though most places have great return policies, you don't want to go through 5 sets before your happy.

I started this post with the comment about my 2000 mits diamond. Because of its blinking problem, I had it exchanged with the 2003 diamond. I assumed that the 2003 would be better than the 2000 model. Wrong. I have now looked at three ws-65711 models in various stores and none of them look near as good with 480p as my old ws-65905. Trust me there is no comparison. Out of the three I looked at, one was ghosting like my tv at home, and the other two were not. However, even without the ghosting the picture was very grainy and had many artifacts. Jagged lines were prevelant. I looked at the 65711 and the 55711 side by side and the 55711 was by far much better with 480p - no artifacts. I don't understand why but that is the case.

Has the 65711 been reviewed for 480p and if so what were the results??? Can anyone point me in a direction to look? Just curious.

Back to my point, now I have to have them take this junky ws-65711 back and, trust me, they are not happy. Sure, they have a return policy but after 2 tvs have been returned, they start to crab up and to some extent I understand. I should have checked the new model out in the store before I had it delivered.

Anyway, in your search, just have them play a dvd for you so you know what you are getting. It won't take more than a minute.

Hey, again thanks for the great info.

Later,
Chet

[huskerdoc2002]

I have owned several HDTVs including Pioneer Elite 64", I just received my new Diamond Mits 65711 this past Thursday and I have to say after toning down the red, it is by far the best HDTV I have seen. There is no ghosting with my set whatsoever, DVD both 480i and 480p is viewed with much more precision than the elite. The black backgrounds are incredible, I think partly to having such an incredible Antiglare screen. I have a simple antenna hooked up for the HDTV OTA and it is incredible watching Leno in HDTV. If anyone else wants me to check anything else out on this set, please let me know. Thanks!!!!

[slc1t]

Since I posted the first message I think I should report on my current situation. I think you will be interested in what I have found. I already posted in the progressive scan dialogue so I am just copying what I posted there...I feel it is important that people have as much information as possible when dealing with HDTV. You pay a lot for a good home theater and I think you are entitled to know as much as possible. Here is my opinion. Take it for what it is worth.

______________________________________

To close out my issue. I just received my mitsubishi ws-65905 back. I can not even begin to describe the difference between the 65711 and 65905 with progressive scan. The 65905 blows the 65711 out of the water! I have had the 65711 in my house for 2 months now and have tried all kinds of things to improve 480p. NOTHING WORKED. Some things helped -- a little. 480p on the 65905 looks better than movies in the theater -- you cannot see any artifacting -- no scan lines. Everything is crystal clear. The 65711 looks like a low quality mpeg. I don't care what anyone else says -- i tried 3 different progressive scan dvd players on the 65711 -- Denon, Pioneer, and my toshiba sd-9200 nothing helped. that set is a piece of junk and does not accept a true 480p signal. I also looked at 3 different 65711 units -- all having the same problems.

My point is...your monitor does matter. And just because a company has produced high quality stuff in the past doesn't mean they will continue to do it. Mitsubishi has seriously degraded their picture quality over the last 3 years. I looked at D-VHS on the 65711 and that didn't even look as good as 480p on the 65905.

A lot of people have been complaining on different boards about new mitsubishi hdtvs and the replys are always 1) turn down contrast, 2) avia dvd disc, blah blah blah. I'll give a quick honest answer. mitsubishi sets suck...at least for right now. But boy did they make a beaty in 2000 with the 65905! I love it.

Take care and always do your homework. No one should be giving advice unless they have looked at the set themselves. I wish everyone happy viewing and a great 2003.

Chet in Boise.

[wmayo]

Chet,
I don't know what it was about your 65711, but I just don't experience or hear about those kinds of problems at all. I watched 55", 65", various models of 2002 and 2003 sets side by side at a small dealer with good tweaked pictures. The 2003 actually stood out with better than ever pictures that were stunning ... so stunning in fact, that I on the spot cancelled my plans to buy a Sony and got a 55" Mits.
Until I got my Dish HD, all I could play was progr. DVDs and they looked fantastic (in 480p) ... so good I wondered if HD could be better than this. Well, it was, but my experience all around has been top notch - all that a Mits was cracked up to be.
Even the jaded HD techs from a local repair shop (ended up being a cable problem) kept going "wow, that is really an unusually great picture" - several times.
Sorry about your experience. Hope you find your solution.
Oh, no serv. menu operations needed for 480p.

[birch1108]

Does anyone know of a good source for finding diagnostic type information/procedures for a Mits VS-5072? My neighbor offered to give me his if I could fix. He said he woke up this morning (Father's Day, of all days), tried to turn it on, but it just didn't. Is there a good series of diagnostics to run through that you know of. And, if I can find the problem, are there parts available?

Thanks in advance,
David Robinson