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View Full Version : Desert Storm redux


kevinw
03-17-2003, 09:25 AM
Source: NY Times

SANTA MONICA, Calif., Mar. 9 - If war is indeed coming soon to Iraq,
images of that war are likely to follow not long afterward at the local
multiplex - all shot in the latest high-definition digital video.
Just as grainy Movietone newsreels brought images of World War II to the
home front, the military hopes the new footage it will present - with
high-technology cameras to match the high-tech weaponry - will provide a far
more crisp and vivid window into this war.
"The impact of war has always been filtered by the poor quality of film
and video," Dale Cripps, publisher of HDTV Magazine, said. "The impact of the
horrors of war in high definition are going to wake a lot of people up."
From the military point of view, the project "is intended to maintain a
strong connection with the American public and create a better understanding
about sailors and the marines, and how the Navy and Marines work together to
accomplish their missions," said Lt. Col. James Kuhn of the Marines, who heads a
Marine and Navy effort to outfit four teams of combat camera operators with
high-definition cameras.
The first newsreel could be in theaters within weeks after war starts, and
since a digital record, unlike celluloid, will not crumble over time, the images
will also provide a record for future generations.
Digital footage of this quality - high definition has five times the
resolution of standard television, plus Dolby-level audio - will probably not
show up on home television sets. No broadcast network plans to send
high-definition cameras into combat, in part because of the difficulty of
transmitting its bandwidth-hungry signal.
"The only way to get a signal back will be via satellite, and transponder
space will be at a premium," said Barbara Cochran, president of the
Radio-Television News Directors Association.
Bill Wheatley, a vice president at NBC News, said NBC will be using
tried-and-true Sony video cameras. "We've looked into using an HD format for
news-gathering in the field, but it's cumbersome, expensive and not easy to
edit," he said. "We'll get to it at some point, but especially for a war we want
to use what's dependable." Gordon Castle, a CNN senior vice president for
technology, said CNN's smaller field cameras are all standard-definition
digital. "Our current infrastructure does not support HD," he said.
The lack of high-definition television news from the Middle East will be
noticed by only a handful of Americans. Jeff Joseph, a vice president at the
Consumer Electronics Association, said 2.4 million digital sets - including
standard, enhanced and high-definition - were sold last year. And Mr. Cripps
noted that fewer than 500,000 of those are able to receive a high-definition
signal, either over the air or via cable.
Just off the tarmac at the Santa Monica Airport, Colonel Kuhn busily
prepared the last details of this mission, a partnership with a civilian
production company, American Rogue Films. The camera teams are expected to be
deployed in the Middle East within days, most likely first to Kuwait.
The newsreel they will create will be the second produced by American
Rogue with the Navy and Marines. The first, "Enduring Freedom - The Opening
Chapter," was made after the Sept. 11 attacks and screened before the main
features at about 200 Regal Cinemedia theaters. Regal Cinemedia now has digital
projection capabilities for 2,000 screens in 160 theaters across the country,
said Lauren Leff, a vice president
For Navy and Marine Corps camera operators, their unofficial mentor is
Norman T. Hatch, a former Marine staff sergeant, who was honored with an Academy
Award in 1944 for his World War II short "With the Marines at Tarawa." Mr.
Hatch, 83, who has discussed the new project with crew members, carried a
35-millimeter camera, a format that has largely been abandoned in favor of
lighter 16-millimeter cameras and, more recently, video. The new Panavision-Sony
camera, at 25 to 35 pounds, will be half the weight of a comparable
35-millimeter camera, though far heavier than other digital video cameras.
The cameras are able to withstand extremes of weather, as demonstrated by
their use in numerous nature documentaries. Another advantage is the 50-minute
cassette capacity, compared with 11 minutes for a 1,000-foot roll of
35-millimeter film. But most important is the ability to capture digital
imagery.
The footage will be put to multiple uses, including a four- to five-minute
newsreel. Budgeted at $1.2 million, it will be directed by Klaus Obermeyer of
American Rogue.
Captain Matt Morgan, who will head one Marine camera team, said there were
also internal discussions to produce more newsreels.
Most important, he and other combat camera operators see it as an
opportunity for a meticulous documentation of the action. "We want the big
picture," said Navy Chief John Wilson, who will operate one of the two
Panavision-Sony high-definition cameras. "The footage we shoot could be used 50
years from now to train soldiers in boot camp."
In addition to the Panavision-Sony HDW-F900 cameras, Colonel Kuhn's crew
will use seven Panasonic AG-DVX100's, which offer the same 24-frame-per-second
rate. This allows easy transfer from video to film.
Chief Warrant Officer B. Sean Fairburn of the Marines, who will operate
the other Sony camera, also sees the project as an opportunity to paint a
lasting picture of marines and sailors in combat. "If I document everything
well," he said, "any number of future uses can be made from it. When I'm in
combat, shooting, I'm carving up an elephant to serve to hundreds of people.

heatho
03-17-2003, 02:55 PM
I'm sure all the media guys have been trained on what to do and what not to do... but I sure hope they stay out of the way and let our service men do their jobs.

Lets Roll!

God bless the USA!

kevinw
03-17-2003, 03:32 PM
I am torn between I want to see this in HD to why do we have to see this at all. I guess this will all be on the History ChannelHD in the future.

BrettD
03-17-2003, 07:00 PM
I've been in the military (no combat) and unless you actually "experience" it or see it, there can be liittle, if any, appreciation of the sacrifces made by military personnel. Not to mention the "realities" of war ( including horror).
I think we are almost desensitized by terrible doings, in that they are becoming almost everyday occurrences.
Let it not be said that big business would not take advantage of an opportunity to use the higest-tech video medium to profit from!
HD war footage (albeit editted) is a compelling proposition. The more I saw of Desert Storm footage, the more it seemed mundane and commonplace. However, I am curious as to what and how much will be shown to the people of the world through the video footage of the embedded reporters should we go to war! :rolleyes:

cherokee21
03-17-2003, 08:00 PM
:mad: Well I have been in combat and this thread turns my stomach as does our leader=King George! Heatho-you must be a WWF fan-it's all bullshit!

mikehbkwm
03-17-2003, 08:56 PM
I personally am glad we are going to war we need to get rid of this PSYCHO if its possible. Again this is my opinion and my grandfather was in WWII and is a very patriot person and has kinda instilled those values in me. Now Im not going to get into any kind of argument with anyone on this site about politics cause this is a site HDTV. Just thought Id voice my opinion................

cherokee21
03-17-2003, 09:02 PM
:( Didn't mean to be testy but, Damn, I get mad about the glorification of this so called war. Want to see what it's really about and what I saw, get Hamburger Hill, or as I remember it, the Ap Bia Mountain-Hill 937. Most likely our new young troops will never live through that nightmare. But how we can have a draft dodging leader who didn't finish his reserve obligation-really pisses me off when he thinks he can send our youth into battle and depose a leader of a country even though he is an asshole! Wonder why he doesn't want to challenge another asshole -namely North Korea-wouldn't be a cake walk, would it? What a puke! There I go again, the TV is great!

cherokee21
03-17-2003, 09:07 PM
:rolleyes: Sorry Mike, posted before your message but as you can tell my dander was up! Still like Cox however and most of the digital is great!

cherokee21
03-17-2003, 09:15 PM
:( Oh and one more thing-the government will hold the oil field revenues in trust for the Iraqi people. Tell that to my grandmother and great grandfather reference the oil property they had in Oklahoma-Cherokee Nation-Puhleeeeze! Okay sorry Kevin-I had a bad day-still love you guys!

mikehbkwm
03-17-2003, 09:59 PM
Well anything related to our cherokee nation I'll agree with you on Cherokee21 cause I myself am almost a half blood cherokee. That might not be that much to you but Im very proud of my cherokee ancestory.............

kevinw
03-17-2003, 10:40 PM
I know that this has gone off topic but it did illicit the feelings Iwanted to see.
No matter if you are for or against this upcoming conflict there is no middle of the road and much of it is going to be shown in HD. Kind of hard to care about a hobby like this when all the rest is happenning.
I am not in favor of this venture but since it seems inevitable, lets hope it is over quickly and with least amount of lives lost. Lets hope as may as possible come home alive and unscarred.

billw
03-18-2003, 08:08 AM
I am not in favor of war. I am in favor of change.

If Bush would have said (2 weeks before the towers fell) we are going to war with Afghanistan because Bin Laden is building plans to create terror against our homeland. We would have said Bush was crazy.

I did not vote for George Bush but I back him. He is our president. I think he has the right idea. Enough of these pyscho dictators.

Moreover, I support the troops. Lets hope for a quick and decisive victory.

Not just for us, but for the Iraqi people and the international community.

Bill


btw - I love my rights as an American!

heatho
03-18-2003, 10:11 AM
Cherokee21,
What the heck was that all about? Give me a break! For the record, The US Military used "Lets Roll" as a moto after Sept. 11th. It is in reference to what Todd Beamer said right before he and several others became heroes in Pennsylvania.

If you think for one minute that I was trying to "glorify" anything you are wrong. Do we really need to see this war all over our TVs? probably not.

I'm sorry I helped get your "Dander" up... I was just trying to show my support for our troops and our President.

zuerchers
03-18-2003, 11:22 AM
cherokee21...you're an idiot. if you ever pull your head out of your liberal ass maybe you'll be able to see straight. you're not anti war, you're anti Bush. admit it. when this is over and you see the people of iraq dancing in the streets because they are finally FREE, maybe you'll see it differently. when we find all the weapons that he claims he doesn't have, maybe then you'll see it differently. i doubt it though because, again, you are not anti war, you are anti Bush. i am sure you will always find fault with him. now go listen to the dixie chicks...

zuerchers
03-18-2003, 11:30 AM
See men shredded, then say you don't back war
By Ann Clwyd



“There was a machine designed for shredding plastic. Men were dropped into it and we were again made to watch. Sometimes they went in head first and died quickly. Sometimes they went in feet first and died screaming. It was horrible. I saw 30 people die like this. Their remains would be placed in plastic bags and we were told they would be used as fish food . . . on one occasion, I saw Qusay [President Saddam Hussein’s youngest son] personally supervise these murders.”

This is one of the many witness statements that were taken by researchers from Indict — the organisation I chair — to provide evidence for legal cases against specific Iraqi individuals for war crimes, crimes against humanity and genocide. This account was taken in the past two weeks.

Another witness told us about practices of the security services towards women: “Women were suspended by their hair as their families watched; men were forced to watch as their wives were raped . . . women were suspended by their legs while they were menstruating until their periods were over, a procedure designed to cause humiliation.”

The accounts Indict has heard over the past six years are disgusting and horrifying. Our task is not merely passively to record what we are told but to challenge it as well, so that the evidence we produce is of the highest quality. All witnesses swear that their statements are true and sign them.

For these humanitarian reasons alone, it is essential to liberate the people of Iraq from the regime of Saddam. The 17 UN resolutions passed since 1991 on Iraq include Resolution 688, which calls for an end to repression of Iraqi civilians. It has been ignored. Torture, execution and ethnic-cleansing are everyday life in Saddam’s Iraq.

Were it not for the no-fly zones in the south and north of Iraq — which some people still claim are illegal — the Kurds and the Shia would no doubt still be attacked by Iraqi helicopter gunships.


For more than 20 years, senior Iraqi officials have committed genocide, war crimes and crimes against humanity. This list includes far more than the gassing of 5,000 in Halabja and other villages in 1988. It includes serial war crimes during the Iran-Iraq war; the genocidal Anfal campaign against the Iraqi Kurds in 1987-88; the invasion of Kuwait and the killing of more than 1,000 Kuwaiti civilians; the violent suppression, which I witnessed, of the 1991 Kurdish uprising that led to 30,000 or more civilian deaths; the draining of the Southern Marshes during the 1990s, which ethnically cleansed thousands of Shias; and the summary executions of thousands of political opponents.

Many Iraqis wonder why the world applauded the military intervention that eventually rescued the Cambodians from Pol Pot and the Ugandans from Idi Amin when these took place without UN help. They ask why the world has ignored the crimes against them?

All these crimes have been recorded in detail by the UN, the US, Kuwaiti, British, Iranian and other Governments and groups such as Human Rights Watch, Amnesty and Indict. Yet the Security Council has failed to set up a war crimes tribunal on Iraq because of opposition from France, China and Russia. As a result, no Iraqi official has ever been indicted for some of the worst crimes of the 20th century. I have said incessantly that I would have preferred such a tribunal to war. But the time for offering Saddam incentives and more time is over.

I do not have a monopoly on wisdom or morality. But I know one thing. This evil, fascist regime must come to an end. With or without the help of the Security Council, and with or without the backing of the Labour Party in the House of Commons tonight.



The author is Labour MP for Cynon Valley.

57U
03-18-2003, 11:31 AM
Originally posted by zuerchers cherokee21...you're an idiot. Please refrain from any Flames, they are not tolerated on this site. I know this is a "hot" topic, but everyone's entitled to an opinion.

This is not really HDTV talk anyway so lets get back to HDTV.

cherokee21
03-18-2003, 07:14 PM
57U: thhanks for putting things into perspective, the only thing I will say to Z-is improve your spelling, change your moniker (picture) and I might respond. Heatho-sorry I was wrong. Mike be proud of the blood.

Now to the good stuff but probably a simple question, on my Denon Receiver, it seemingly locks into PL-II M and also indicates Dolby Pro-Logic. How does that relate to the surround sound that I think I am suppose to be getting but everything seems to come from the center, left and right front speakers?

cherokee21
03-18-2003, 07:16 PM
Geeze and I spelled thanks wrong right out of the gate. Trying to go for one hundred:o

mikehbkwm
03-18-2003, 07:33 PM
Hey just a quick ? does the Denon receiver support 5.1, and Im not trying to be smart just wanting to make sure.

cherokee21
03-18-2003, 08:08 PM
Mike=I think it does but that is why I asked the question.

mikehbkwm
03-18-2003, 08:20 PM
Well if it doesnt then you wont be able to listen to movies in DD5.1 or DTS5.1 I had a guy call me up recently wanting to know why his DENON receiver didnt have DD5.1 and I asked him if it supported it and he said well I dont know and I asked him how old is your receiver and he said about 10yrs old. I then said well then it prob. doesnt support it. Id have to take a guess and say that maybe your receiver doesnt support it if it doesnt say DD5.1 or DTS on the front of the receiver...........

cherokee21
03-18-2003, 10:18 PM
It's a Denon AVR 1403-less than 1 1/2 years old-I think it does support it-better read the manual I guess-huh?

57U
03-18-2003, 10:43 PM
Yep, DD5.1, DTS, Dolby Pro-Logic II, etc.

http://www.hookedontronics.com/show_product_details.jsp?cid=1534

cherokee21
03-18-2003, 10:48 PM
Thanks 57U will read the manual and if I have any questions will post=Thanks for bearing with me during my gut feeling anger about certain topics!:o

           


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