DVI connection

[xsparky]

I was just wondering if It would be wise to wait for the summer/fall HDTV line up when most of the manufactures will be including the DVI connection on there sets.(Sony,Toshiba,and others)
Any comments would be helpful, or is this not that important of an issue.
Thanks.

[Harvey S]

Yes you should wait rather than take the risk that yoiur expensive new TV will not be capable of handling the encrypted broadcasts that may be coming our way if the manufacturers and content providers have their way.

Some of SONY's new models will be available by July 02.

[schmaeher]

FutureShop in Canada has a JVC 48 inch "l'Art" HDTV with the DVI HDCP connector for sale as of about 2 weeks ago. The new sets are coming soon, I also noted that it seems to be about the same price as a comparable Panasonic (both sets made by Matusta (sp?)).

[57U]

I just got the latest copy of Sound and Vision. In the ads at the back there are a couple of Toshiba HDTVs (50H82, 65H82) with "DVI Upgradeable" written on the ad. Don't know exactly what that entails, but it gives hope to all of us.... Not that I think DVI will become a big issue, but...

[JoeInBH]

Are there any HDTV's out there that are NOT DVI-upgradable? If the store or manufacturer is promising a free upgrade, it sounds like a nice perk. Otherwise, DVI-upgradable is about as meaningful as "HDTV antenna."

Joe

[Harvey S]

So far I have not heard of one manufacturer that has announced an upgrade program to install the DVI/HDCP interface in existing sets that were made without the capability. Even Mitsubishi's 'promise program' does not mention DVI/HDCP.

Remember the DVI/HDCP hardware must go INSIDE the set. It cannot be a separate black box that decrypts the HDCP encoded signal outside the TV and sends it to the TV over the component connections included in present sets. An upgrade of this kind can only be provided by the manufacturer, not the store selling the set. Check those ads out very carefully.

[JoeInBH]

1. Who says that the DVI converter must be INSIDE the set? I have heard that that is what DVI proponents would like to see, but I know of no law requiring it. From what I've read, an external DVI-HDCP to component converter is surprising easy to make. The only reason you don't see them at every Best Buy is because there is currently no encrypted programming out there and there's a strong chance there never will be any need for a converter.

2. Why is it that only a set's manufacturer can provide a DVI upgrade? Why can't JoeCo. or HarveyCo. built DVI upgrade kits to popular HDTV models? If (just for the sake of argument) DVI converters MUST be inside the set, that still does not mean the original manufacturer has to be involved. Just open up your set and put it in there. Those reluctant to do so can pay a technician $100 to do it for them.

Joe

[Harvey S]

Originally posted by JoeInBH
1. Who says that the DVI converter must be INSIDE the set? I have heard that that is what DVI proponents would like to see, but I know of no law requiring it. From what I've read, an external DVI-HDCP to component converter is surprising easy to make. The only reason you don't see them at every Best Buy is because there is currently no encrypted programming out there and there's a strong chance there never will be any need for a converter.

To legally get the decryption engine it will be necessary to sign a licensing agreement with the folks who own it and they are the ones who are intent on restricting the hdcp decoder to circuitry INSIDE the display. They won't license the technology to anyone who wants to build an external converter because the output of that converter could be sent into the HD recording devices they fear and wish to prevent or cripple. It is possible to crack the decryption key (already been done) and then build an unlicensed converter box to use outside the set. The unlicensed converter may be illegal already under the digital millenium act if it is deemed to be a device intended to subvert copyright laws. IMHO it will only exist as a blackmarket device and then only if the decryption engine can't be disabled by embedded codes in the programming material, as has been rumored.
Originally posted by JoeInBH
2. Why is it that only a set's manufacturer can provide a DVI upgrade? Why can't JoeCo. or HarveyCo. built DVI upgrade kits to popular HDTV models? If (just for the sake of argument) DVI converters MUST be inside the set, that still does not mean the original manufacturer has to be involved. Just open up your set and put it in there. Those reluctant to do so can pay a technician $100 to do it for them.

Joe
You might be right about that but Joe or Harvey would still have to sign the license to get the hdcp decryption engine they are selling, and would risk voiding the manufacturers warranty on some expensive equipment ! Not clear how good a business we'd be starting since all new sets would already have the DVI/HDCP hardware and we'd just be marketing to a limited number of older sets divided up amongst an ungodly number of manufacturers/models.

[JoeInBH]

Harvey - I did significant research last night in an attempt to answer my questions to you. I read through the licensing agreements (available at http://www.digital-cp.com) and a synopsis of the digital millenium act. I'm an attorney and still had a relatively rough time getting through it. Nevertheless, I'll concede that you are correct - the licensing agreement would create significant liability for anyone intending to marekt an external decoder. Even the internal decoders would present a problem unless sufficiently secure. Do-it-yourself kits would definitely be out of the picture. Due to the legal issues, the cheapest and easiest solution will likely be black-market boxes (this isn't entirely clear, however - if the Digital Millenium Act had teeth why are MP3 players available everywhere?). There's currently a very vibrant market for DirecTV cards, etc. and I suspect this will be no different, although my initial hunch that an easy solution will be available at your local Best Buy was probably incorrect.

Joe

[Harvey S]

Originally posted by JoeInBH
- if the Digital Millenium Act had teeth why are MP3 players available everywhere?). There's currently a very vibrant market for DirecTV cards, etc. and I suspect this will be no different, although my initial hunch that an easy solution will be available at your local Best Buy was probably incorrect.

Joe

MP3 is compression not encryption. MP3 players do not contain a licensed decoder and have a legitimate use since MP3 compression can legally be applied to many materials. Also, I recently read an article on piracy (I believe in a United Airline magazine) that said that the satellite companies can, and do, disable illegal cards with an embedded code. Obviously they don't do this on a daily basis and I'm not sure why. The MPAA and whoever else is behind HDCP is said to plan the same capability. If true then illegal unlicensed devices will have very short lifetimes unless they can somehow be reconfigured or reloaded with new software. Probably the most viable approach is to use a PC as your decoder. The article described someone doing that for the satellite signal and he was able to stay a step ahead of the piracy police. That requires significant computer skills and won't be a mass market solution.