Antena Talk

[newtohdtv]

Hi.

I've seen the Antena links. Very useful but I'm looking for some more basic info. I live in Pasadena, CA which is in the Los Angeles Area.

1. Can I use an indoor antena to receive my digital channels? If so what model and where should I buy it at what price.

2. Do I need an outdoor antena? If so what model and where should I buy it for what price?

3. Is there any such thing as a wireless antena that would do the job? If so what model......

Thanks, n2hdtv

[zarlor]

My usual reccomendation is to check out, for UHF signals, the Radio Shack double bowtie antenna. It's cheap and you can always return it if it doesn't work for you. Plus you can always just keep trying to move up models of antennas to the amplified indoor antennas if you like and just turn right back around and return them if they don't do you any good. It's probably better to find out that you HAVE to spend $80 for an outdoor antenna than to find out that a $10 antenna would have actually done the trick, if you ask me.

[freddyfred89]

FYI, Radioshack's website lists the double bowtie antenna as no longer available. Radioshack Egypt has it, but there's no way I'm going to that part of the world anytime soon.

;)

Here is Radioshack US' site for double bow tie (http://www.radioshack.com/ProdSupport/DocumentDetail/DocumentDetailIndex.asp?URL=http://support.radioshack.com/support_video/39284.htm)

note the lack of info and the inability to buy.

On the other hand ...

Here is Radioshack Egypt's site (note the address) (http://www.deltars.com.eg/main/product_details.asp?product_id=4541)

Personally, I've had decent luck with this rather expensive unit from RS:

Expensivo (http://www.radioshack.com/product.asp?catalog%5Fname=CTLG&category%5Fname=CTLG%5F002%5F002%5F008%5F001&product%5Fid=15%2D1890)

[JoeInBH]

I agree that a cheap indoor Radio Shack antenna is the best place to start. Move up from there if need be. I get all my local OTA channels (in Boston) using $15 rabbit ears from RS on top of my TV.

One thing no one has mentioned is that you will probably have to do a lot of playing around with the antenna. It took me a few hours just to get one station to come in clearly. I spend several more nights playing around to get all my stations to come in with one set-up. Things to toggle include: location of antenna, direction of antenna, amount (if any) of amplification, whether to cross your rabbit ears, etc., etc., etc. My ideal setup actually points away from the towers and has no amplification. Bottom line - and something Newbies may not realize - you can't just hook up the antenna and expect it to work. This is especially true if you're using an indoor antenna and live in a dense urban environment or otherwise have a lot of obstructions. My fiance went nuts with how long I spent with that darn thing, but I actually kind of enjoyed the challenge. Good luck.

Joe

[g4love]

I started with a Radio Shack bowtie with rabbit ears and only came up with 2 (cbs, abc) OTA signals. I returned it and I'm now trying a Megawave (non-amplified). I'm up to 3 (cbs, abc, nbc). Like you Joe, I find this "treasure" hunt beguiling yet interesting.

I'm about 20 miles out of Philly so with the right antenna I'll get as many 10. Since my toys are in the basement, my journey is that much more difficult.

The next thing I'm going to try is putting the antenna in the attic and use a couple of diplexers.

The relentless pursuit for continues,

-e

[Ratman]

Friends....

Bottom line is....

Indoor antennas (99%) of the time will not be adequate. For those that it does work are lucky. (But, I don't have to adjust the antenna with each channel I change nor do I have to look at it!)

Digital signals (8VSB) is VERY susceptible to 'multipath interference'. If you even MOVE in the room, you will get a dropout.

I went through an RCA indoor ($20), a Terk indoor (amplified)($40), the R/S "HDTV Indoor Antenna ($80), and the Terk-55 ($150). Hear this... none of them worked well/consistently!

I am only 20-25 miles from the towers. The only stable signal I get is with an attic mounted R/S UHF only Yagi ($20).

Do not waste you time, effort, gas, whatever. Just go with a 'real' antenna either attic or outdoor mounted and be done with it!

My $.02

[freddyfred89]

I think you overlook the possibility that some people use indoor antennas because they must.

I live in a three-story apartment complex and I have access to neither the roof nor the attic. This is why I use an indoor antenna.

While it may be tricky to get an indoor antenna to provide satisfactory signal, I have met with success using this approach (I get approx 4 channels OTA). Given that fact that only three networks really broadcast OTA, I think this is pretty good ...

[kevinw]

Freddy,
Do not discount that RS Yagi that Ratman is talking about. It is small enough to set in a window. It may not be pretty but does work.Many testomonials from the forums.

I think what Ratman was implying is that instead of experimenting , as he did, save the time and effort and go with a proven winner.

I Went with the RS VU-160 on my roof with the RS 25 DB amp. I am 45-50 miles from Towers with hilly terrain. All my signals are 90+. Am I lucky that it worked right away. You bet. I read horror stories all of the time from The Atlanta DTV group about the problems they have. My theory is go as big as you can or your wife/husband will let you.

[Ratman]

Originally posted by freddyfred89
I think you overlook the possibility that some people use indoor antennas because they must.

I live in a three-story apartment complex and I have access to neither the roof nor the attic. This is why I use an indoor antenna.

While it may be tricky to get an indoor antenna to provide satisfactory signal, I have met with success using this approach (I get approx 4 channels OTA). Given that fact that only three networks really broadcast OTA, I think this is pretty good ...

Calm down son!
I am happy that your indoor solution works for you! If you look around on other forums, you will see that indoor antennas are generally unsuccessful/unsatifactory. Also, I was posting to try to be helpful and save the original poster some aggrevation based on my experience (and others').

You fall into the 1% that indoor antennas work.

But do not assume that because it works for you that this will work for everyone else.

Also, as an apartment dweller, you have rights (FCC regulations) as to where you can mount an antenna and the size it can be.
Also, you may try to convince the landlord to allow you mount an antenna on the roof and allow other renters to 'tap in'. And... you can tell tell the landlord that he can take all of the credit.

[newtohdtv]

Thanks for the great posts. I have plenty of attic and roof space so it sounds like I'll forego the indoor and go straight to the yagi. Dish is coming to mount my second dish for free thanks to a law requiring them to offer all my local channels not just the networks so maybe I can bribe the installer to run the antena cale at the same time.

Take care, n2hdtv

[wmayo]

OK - I saw the comment on multipath. I live in an area that has a very STRONG signal but with bad ghosting on analog viewing. (I live behind a mountain but very near the transmitter, and there are other mts. around)

Here's the question (before I go and spend many hundreds of dollars on the off-air unit) - Will the multipath pretty much destoy hopes of a lock? Or is it a matter of fiddling until I get a strong enough primary signal (with double images/paths low enough) and thus LOCK? Anyone with similar experience?

Thanks

WM

[Ratman]

wmayo,
No one can/could you a definitive answer as to what your success may ot may not be for reception.

If you now experience bad ghosting with analog, then you will probably have some digital issues. That's not to say it's hopeless.

Since you do get 'strong' signals, that may be of benefit. What you have are the mountains bouncing the signals all around. What the ATSC tuner will do is constantly 'switch' from received signal to received signal coming from various directions. The tuner continually attempts to lock on the multiple signals.

Okay... first off. You should go with a yagi antenna. This is the most directional. By being directional. the beam of reception is narrower and will focus in one general direction. Look for an antenna that has good side and back/front rejection.

Also, you may find that aiming the antenna in a another direction will be better (by catching a refelected signal).

And... you may bet the results by using a rotor. Even though all the x-miiters may be in one direction, you may have to point in one direction for 1 station and point in the opposite direction for another.

It's a lot of trial and error, but well worth it once you get the right combination/position(s). Have fun!

[tcable]

I'm one fo the lucky ones tha gets decent channels with a set top antenna. down teh road, I might go to a rooftop, but I can't complain here. Being in the flatlands outside of Boston helps :), and I'm 30 miles form the xmitter site.

Tim

[moody]

No TV yet.

If I can receive a regular signal from say cleveland or pittsburgh on a regular antenna will the HDTV signal be received if I had the tuner/HDTV.

Are they transmitting both signals equally. Do both signals travel the same distance. Are there 2 signals???

[moody]

I picked up a few cheap antennas at Radio Shack last night. Their Stick antenna(looks like Terk-55) that has an electrical cord to plug in gets better reception than their small UHF only antenna with no pre-amp.

I can get 1 out of the 3 channels that I need with the UHF only antenna and 3 out of 3 with the stick antenna. The 2 that I don't get with the uhf come in very poorly on the stick. THese are analog channels using an analog tv.(trying to test signal strength)

Keep in mind I'm standing inside our house on our bed. The stick antenna is an indoor antenna and the other is an outdoor antenna.

WHo can tell me that I'm on the right track? I'm not sure of the specs for these antennas, something like 10 db gain??

Experiemtning with these so that I can buy the right winegard or channelmaster, but it sounds like i might try the RS amplified indoor.

Can I assume that if I can get the analog signal that i will be able to recieve that respcetive channels digital signal. THe digital towers locations are within a few miles of each other.

My strongest of the three is 56 miles away. The two weaker channels are in the same range but must have a weaker output.

any input is welcome.

Joe

[zarlor]

Well, as I posted in the other thread you just asked this in....

It sounds like a logical assumption that you could get the digital channels by checking reception on the analog channels, but I'd want to make certain that the digital towers really are located near the analog towers. Even so more than a few local broadcasters seem to be broadcasting at low power on their digital channel for now, which usually means a smaller footprint of where their signal can be picked up. The only real way to test that I know of is to just use a digital tuner to check your signal strengths. There might be better, or at least cheaper, ways to check, though. Anyone else have some thoughts?

[tcable]

I'd be interested in seeing signal strength without a large investment in equipment too. I'm in between the Boston and Providence markets, and I get good reception of the Boston channels with rabbit ears, but we're going to go to an outdoor antenna just to avoid the dropouts from people or dogs moving around the house :) I just seems that Providence is not live yet, or is transmitting on a very limited basis.

I'm now very happy that we got the integrated tuner in our TV. It measn that we can enjoy the exisitng HD programming- JAG in HD is worth it alone.

I saw a wingard UHF antenna today for ~$60 that should provide excellent reception. I'd couple it with an amp and be very good to go.

Tim